here is a link for a GMA story on the doll study.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=2553348&page=1

"Again, as I said, he said he isn't, yet we're not just talking saying nigger Baker, where did all those other stuff come from?"

Where did that quote from Byrd come from? Where did the 'n' word come from when he used it on Fox News in 2001? He claims he was a member of the KKK because he hated communists and wanted something to do as a youth.

We're expected to believe him. We can't believe Richards? He should be exiled from entertainment, but we let Byrd sit in the Senate? Which do you think has given more warning signs?

"I do agree with Elie that what Al Sharpton does, some of it, does lead to divide. "

Leads to DIVIDE? LOL... it lead to the DEATHS of Jews. After that, after talking about 'homos' and using racist remarks about white people, consistantly behaving antisemitically, he was a rewarded as a keynote speaker at the DNC. You might want to look closer.

There's no excuse for a comedian to spew racist insults for longer than a single joke. They're supposed to be professionals, for chrissake. If they can't do their act without overreacting to hecklers they should get off the stage permanently.

Again, cacto, why are we supposed to believe it when people like Byrd, Sharpton, etc., say that their racist actions don't define them, but then not believe Richards in a single event. The NAACP PROMOTES Byrd, for heaven's sake.

Like I said, when people come forward saying he did stuff like this privately, I will be a lot more apt to call him a racist. Until then, I think he deserves the same benefit of the doubt that these obviously racist people get. He behaved unprofessionally, once that I know of. You think that means permanent exile?

The NAACP PROMOTES Byrd, for heaven's sake.

That statement smacks me of the ultimate hypocrisy. Not on Baker's part, but on all other levels. The NAACP, and Byrds. And then mentioning heaven in the quote.

This Kramer guy is chicken feed compared to the filth that is coming from the first 2, and they will never reach the last one.

That was pretty rough, to watch I think he did the right thing to apologize, but as a person there are just some things you don't do to other people, being a racist and giving into your anger like that, it can happen to anybody I suppose but it's very sad.

Not only to the that have tried so hard to move the country if not the world beyond this kinda treatment but to just bring it up, to use racial slurs as ammo, for what? Being rude during a comedy outing, like your audience isn't the customer anymore I guess, Richards is going to pay handily for his words and actions.

I just don't understand whats so wrong with people giving you some gruff or talking during your act. When do you get so big in the fake life that is "celebrity", that you fail to remember who people are.

The people who were offended, instead of having been able to have a relaxing night out, get to have that imprinted into their minds as to how awful a person can be, and the rest of us get to yet again be reminded of how cruel and mean one person can be to another.

Yea Mr.Richards, instead of politely asking them to be quiet, or leave, or just staring them down, putting the spotlight on them for a min, you go off on a raging racial tirade, and now you'll get what you deserve and more, for your actions and words. It is unfortunate you couldn't think 30 seconds ahead of yourself. Most unfortunate indeed.

"Yea Mr.Richards, instead of politely asking them to be quiet, or leave, or just staring them down, putting the spotlight on them for a min, you go off on a raging racial tirade"

Do you have a link to what happened before the rant? You seem to be referring to what he didn't do, I just wondered how you know he didn't do it.

Again, cacto, why are we supposed to believe it when people like Byrd, Sharpton, etc., say that their racist actions don't define them, but then not believe Richards in a single event. The NAACP PROMOTES Byrd, for heaven's sake.

It might not define Kramer as a person, but he's an idiot for giving into the urge to spend his show counter-heckling. Ask any comedian how they deal with hecklers and I'm pretty sure the answer won't be "oh, insult their race and then go into a long tirade against them". Usually it's either ignore or a snappy comeback.

We should expect better from our comedians.

We should expect better of our legislators than to use the 'n' word on national TV. We should expect more of our presidents than getting a hummer in the oval office. We should expect more of our civil rights leaders than to instigate the actual deaths of jews.

I just have a feeling if we wanna talk about expectations, you got lifetimes of reflection before you even work your way down to the stand-up comedians.

Maybe, but the right of comedians to say what they like is predicated on them making it funny. When they start throwing insults and meaning them they drag down the reputation of the entire profession. Kramer should retire or find a new profession, cos the last thing the comedic profession needs is for an excuse to be made for its legislation.

I expect nothing of politicians. They're far too willing to debase themselves for a vote, and therefore are not to be trusted.

"When they start throwing insults and meaning them they drag down the reputation of the entire profession."

OMG, urm, have you studied the history of stand-up? Heard many of the old, Catskills-to-Vegas comedians that created the craft? There's been plenty of stuff worse than that which was INTENDED to be there.

If it was going to be legislated, I think they would have started with Lenny Bruce, or Richard Pryor, or Eddie Murphy, or Andrew Dice Clay. One guy losing his temper isn't enough to foul HIS career, much less the whole genre. SHouldn't be, anyway.

I mean, good lord, has anyone heard what Lisa Lampanelli has said about black men at fryers club roasts?

OMG, urm, have you studied the history of stand-up? Heard many of the old, Catskills-to-Vegas comedians that created the craft? There's been plenty of stuff worse than that which was INTENDED to be there.

Sure. But audiences thought that was funny back then. You have to know your audience. As has been said, the hecklers laughed after the first few jokes, but then they realised Kramer was serious. Taking things seriously is the only real crime for a comic.

SHouldn't be, anyway.

Hot Coffee was enough to smear the games industry and it was extremely difficult to unlock. Do you really believe the censorial PC police on both sides of politics aren't so thin-skinned they'd jump at anything for the chance to stand out?

I'd like to think people in general are more civilised, but it's hard to see any evidence of that.

>>> if he says he isn't racist, why would you behave like this?

Because it's easy to attack a stereotype of a person's color. It seems to me like he was attacking the stereotype of the people who were heckling him. And he brought up sensitive history, which crossed the line. Quite frankly, I think he's so unimaginative that he couldn't come up with a retort without resorting to stereotype and offensive race-based attack.

That guy wasn't a comic act even on Seinfeld. Anybody could have filled that role.

here is a link for a GMA story on the doll study. http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=2553348&page=1

Thx Loca! I got mine in an email but I did see the ABC coverage.

Where did that quote from Byrd come from?

Actually, I was referring to Richards, not Byrd. But thx for the insight on that one since I didn't follow it. I followed Richards more because I've always admired him as an actor/comedian. Byrd, well, we all know Byrd will still remain where he is, and is right there at the moment!

We can't believe Richards? He should be exiled from entertainment

No, Richards should not be exiled, I don't agree with that at all. I'm not calling for his ostracization or anything like that. I'm trying to understand how someone like him, being in the field he's in, open to enlightenment and acceptance, could react the way he did and why if it wasn't there before, he says, why is it now. A mute point me trying to understand I guess but I'm thinking out loud rhetorically! (if there's such a thing!)

Leads to DIVIDE? ... it lead to the DEATHS of Jews. After that, after talking about 'homos' and using racist remarks about white people, consistantly behaving antisemitically, he was a rewarded as a keynote speaker at the DNC. You might want to look closer.

Thx but I don't need to look closer. Because I lived in NY and got used to Al and his rhetoric and his shannanigans. Like I said before, there was a time when the noise he made, in some instances were necessary. What he does now, I don't follow as closely anymore. I do know that when things like this happens, there are the few that will roll around in mud and spit for a bit then go off someplace else. It's like taking out the popcorn, pulling up a chair to watch the spectacle if it interests you, or changing the channel. If the DNC made him keynote speaker, I guess they saw in him what they needed.

If they can't do their act without overreacting to hecklers they should get off the stage permanently.

Yes Cacto, this is the thing that most people are saying. Hecklers are such a part of being in the routine of a comedian. Even to the best ones it happens! If one can't stand the heat....their choice to stay or not because it goes with the territory.

That statement smacks me of the ultimate hypocrisy. Not on Baker's part, but on all other levels. The NAACP, and Byrds. And then mentioning heaven in the quote.

Huh? Heaven?

get to have that imprinted into their minds as to how awful a person can be, and the rest of us get to yet again be reminded of how cruel and mean one person can be to another.

Yes, not a good reminder Dan.

putting the spotlight on them for a min,

This is the norm in the comedy routine for most of them I understand and from the live shows I've watched!

and now you'll get what you deserve and more, for your actions and words.

He'll get the different reactions but now he's apologise, he'll be shunned for a while and then back on his feet again! Hey look at all the others who have done stuff like this. It doesn't matter if they are black or white.

You seem to be referring to what he didn't do, I just wondered how you know he didn't do it.

It's quite obvious what he didn't do Baker. He didn't continue in the same vene he started off in, heckling back, making a big skit out of it. It turned into a personal insult match. The thing is he's not new on the comedy circuit, he's quite experienced. That's why I'm saying he had a bad day.

Unfortunately not one soon to be forgotten. But when I think about the things he said makes me sad to think he thinks this way, makes my skin crawl to be honest. It's like you're friends with someone only to find out that they were harboring feelings of such hate and dislike for you while pretending to like you.

Everyone sees Richards, they immediately see Kramer, the goofy guy everyone loves, who made everyone laughed. It's hard for people not to think about that character because he's been in their homes for a long time. I still enjoy reruns! Try looking at it that way, then maybe you can understand why the upset.

Usually it's either ignore or a snappy comeback.We should expect better from our comedians.

I agree!

We should expect better of our legislators than to use the 'n' word on national TV. We should expect more of our presidents than getting a hummer in the oval office. We should expect more of our civil rights leaders than to instigate the actual deaths of jews.

I agree with you on this too!

but the right of comedians to say what they like is predicated on them making it funny. When they start throwing insults and meaning them they drag down the reputation of the entire profession.

I expect nothing of politicians. They're far too willing to debase themselves for a vote, and therefore are not to be trusted.

Good points on both!

Lenny Bruce, or Richard Pryor, or Eddie Murphy, or Andrew Dice Clay. One guy losing his temper isn't enough to foul HIS career, much less the whole genre.

None of these, with the exception of Clay, were so crass as to be insultive with their jokes. People expected them to be the way they were, that was their routine. Clay on the other hand got tiresome after the world realises he really meant and believed every insult he spewed. After that he came under attack, and wasn't funny anymore. Then he tried acting to clean up his image, that didnt' work either. The viewing public are not idiots. The politician thinks we are, see what happend to them!

Lisa Lampanelli has said about black men at fryers club roasts?

Who can believe or even touch anything that is said at the Friars Roast? That's no holds barred setting. Even the furor that happened when Ted Danson and Whoopee Goldberg were an item was ridiculous!

Do you really believe the censorial PC police on both sides of politics aren't so thin-skinned they'd jump at anything for the chance to stand out?

Well said!

I'd like to think people in general are more civilised, but it's hard to see any evidence of that.

Oh I would hate to think that they aren't despite everything!